“I will not come back as a lobbyist for rich people”: An exit interview with Councillor Gord Perks
The veteran of Parkdale–High Park talks about his successes, why taxes are the price of civilization and how Toronto can be a refuge for the world
After 20 years in office, Councillor Gord Perks has decided not to seek re-election in October. A self-described socialist, Perks worked with Greenpeace and the Toronto Environmental Alliance before taking office for Parkdale–High Park in 2006. He was a core member of council’s progressive caucus, dutifully fighting right-leaning mayors Rob Ford and John Tory before serving as Olivia Chow’s chair of the Planning and Housing Committee—one of the most influential jobs at city hall. It’s been a precipitous rise for this public servant, but the man himself is ready to step away. We caught up with Perks to talk about his successes, his regrets and why Toronto isn’t actually divided.
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After two decades at city hall, you’re calling it quits. Why now? It’s just time. I’ve never been entirely comfortable with the trappings of public office. I’ll be sitting in a restaurant with a friend, for instance, and a complete stranger will sit at our table and start telling me what my own opinions are. More often than not, they’ll be wrong. I call it “getting councillored.” Some councillors covet the access to power, but that’s never been me. Under the Doug Ford government, Queen’s Park doubled the size of city wards, shrunk council, brought in strong mayor powers and upended planning laws. That gave us next to no say in the greatest part of our jobs: sitting with people in gyms and working stuff through. I’d like to get back to fostering more productive relationships with citizens, where we conspire to resist all the terrors of the world.
Do you feel like you’ve accomplished what you set out to do? I came to politics from the environmental movement. I wanted real investment in public transit and a real response to climate change. We’ve made incredible strides on both fronts. A little while ago, I rode the Eglinton Crosstown. I remember when the idea of light rail was hated in Toronto, and I was fighting for it with just a small group of friends. A few years ago, I chaired a group that developed the city’s TransformTO Net Zero Strategy, which is fantastic. On poverty and mental health issues, we know that the best medicine is safe, secure housing. Since Olivia Chow became mayor, the city has got back in the game of buying and building housing for the first time in over a generation. It’s revolutionary, and it’s going to make a lot of lives better.
A progressive mayor with new strategies—sounds like a wonderful time to stay on council. Why not stick around to see those things through? The worst thing an elected official can do is believe they’re essential to the work. The stuff I’ve described has only been possible because thousands of people in Parkdale–High Park got up every day and fought for a better city. There are plenty of people who are utterly qualified to come in and continue the work. Personally, I’d like to help, but from somewhere that isn’t public office.
You have less than six months left in that office. Is there a bucket list you’d like to get done? After the last election, my executive assistant and I sat down and made a list of things we wanted to have ready for my handover. Between now and then, we’re going to break ground on a new community centre in Roncesvalles, and we’ve got approvals for the Parkdale Hub, a fantastic new housing project that will include a recreation centre and a library. We’ve also done a lot of work to make our streets safer for everybody—not just car drivers—and we’ve been working to re-naturalize High Park.
On the flip side, are you leaving with any regrets? There have been two or three times in the heat of the moment when I made mistakes, and I’ve apologized. Those of us who are committed to a more just and inclusive world always think about the opportunities we missed. But, as author Ursula K. Le Guin points out, it took 1,000 years to overthrow the divine right of kings. Capitalism might take a little while too.
Under your watch, Parkdale has resisted gentrification better than most neighbourhoods. Are you worried that might come undone under your successor? I’m excited to see who puts their name in the ring. I have confidence in the people of Parkdale–High Park. I’ve always thought of them as partners in a laboratory of creative resistance. Joe Strummer said the future is unwritten, but I’m optimistic.
What’s one thing you’ve learned about Toronto that most people don’t realize? I’ve done something like 1,000 community meetings in church basements, and someone always surprises me. A constituent will have a burst of empathy I didn’t expect. Or someone will come up with a creative way to deal with land speculators or suggest a way to make a neighbourhood a generally better place to live. I’ve had a lot of hard days but a lot of beautiful ones too. These are hard times—hatred, wars, the collapse of the American empire, the growing suspicion of democracy—but Toronto can be an island where we show people that better is possible. We’ve been doing it for a long time, and we can keep going.
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You also have a deep knowledge of city hall’s inner workings. Process-wise, what is holding us back the most? There are two things. Doug Ford has made Toronto less permeable, less flexible and less democratic. We have to reverse that. The other thing is that there’s no city of our size in the democratic world that is as limited in how it pays for stuff. There’s a provincial law saying what taxes we can and can’t collect. Other major cities share the sales and income tax. Without those revenue streams, we can’t build our future. People get funny when I talk about taxes, but I’ve always thought of them as the price of civilization.
Many councillors will defend their seats this October. Should some of them take your lead and make way for new voices? Deciding whether to run for re-election is a very personal decision. I know people who have served for longer than 20 years who still make outstanding contributions. I also know people who have only served for a few years, and I look at them and wonder, What do you think you’re doing here? I’ve never believed in term limits, though: they’re effectively laws telling people they’re not allowed to vote for someone, and that’s something a government should never do.
In the 2023 mayoral election, the people picked Olivia Chow. But you could argue that it was a bit of a fluke since she was running against no incumbent. Will she retain her title? For one thing, nothing Olivia Chow has ever done has been a fluke. She’s dynamic, inclusive and decisive. Before her, we had 13 years of austerity, and it really hurt us as a city. Now, I’m starting to see people’s lives open back up. People have more opportunities to live to the fullest expression of who they are. I hope she stays—but first she’s got to go out there and declare. Hurry up, Olivia! Elections in Toronto are always hard fought.
On the housing file, you had some success expanding sixplexes to several wards across the city, yet they remain illegal in most of the suburbs. How can we overcome that divide? This notion of Toronto being split between downtown and the suburbs is 100 per cent wrong. For one thing, some councillors from the suburbs voted to have their wards included in that plan. You also must consider that there are stark differences between neighbourhoods within a given ward. The people of Swansea, for example, are wonderful, but they’re not the same people as those in Parkdale. Luckily for me, my ward has collectively endorsed progress. If Toronto’s politics are to mature, we must understand that we’re really 100 cities united by a common purpose, not two cities with a divided purpose. That whole binary is false.
In that case, how do we get multiplexes rolled out in a Toronto of 100 cities? Any time we bring in a major change, it starts in some places and not others. That’s how it was with bike lanes and reduced speeds on residential streets. The great thing about local government is that the barrier to policy change is very low. I was in a committee for eight hours today, and someone brought forward a proposal to close a portion of Church Street to automobiles for a couple of months. That’s one street, but everyone is going to be watching, and if we do it right, there will be a clamour for more across the city.
Online reaction to your departure was mixed—plenty of people wished you well, but some of your constituents said they didn’t feel heard. How would you respond to them? There’s such a thing out there as a keyboard warrior, which is why I never read the comments. My staff took away all my social media accounts a couple of years ago, and it was the best thing ever. My phone has been blowing up all day with messages from people I’ve represented, and it’s just lovely stuff. It’s a good life lesson: in this work, you will never make everyone happy. It’s just impossible, so don’t try. Sometimes I receive messages saying, “I may not agree with you, but you’ve always told me the truth and given me a fair hearing.” That’s exactly the compliment I want.
What’s next? Could there be a provincial or federal seat in your future? No—I’m totally done with public office. I’ve been asked a number of times to run, and there’s just no way. Those levels of government are so slow and cumbersome and too far removed from the people I want to represent. Beyond that, I don’t know where I’m going. I don’t have a soft landing arranged—we don’t get those on the left—but I also don’t want one. I absolutely will not come back as a paid lobbyist helping rich people get richer. We’re facing a number of crises, and the root cause is a fundamentally unfair society that’s organized to make the wealthy wealthier. Thankfully, there is also a struggle to make a society that values every person’s life, and there are more ways to be part of that than I can count. I’ve taught at U of T, I’ve written and, believe it or not, I’ve even hosted a TV show. There are so many ways to fight the good fight. I’ll find something.
This interview has been edited for length and clarity.
Anthony Milton is a freelance journalist based in Toronto specializing in long-form magazine writing. He previously worked as an assistant editor at Toronto Life, where he launched the Front Row newsletter. He regularly contributes all sorts of stories to the magazine, including deep dives on sports, business and housing as well as short-form commentary on our ever-changing city, from its obsession with cherry blossoms to its maddening NIMBYism. His work has also appeared in Maclean’s, Ricochet, TVO, the Trillium and more.
