Allah in the Cafeteria: Inside the school prayer scandal at Valley Park Middle School
When the principal at Valley Park Middle School allowed 400 Muslim students to pray in the lunchroom, he thought he was being progressive. What he got was a scandal—over the preaching of conservative Islam and the separation of girls from boys—that’s testing the TDSB’s policy of religious accomodation
Valley Park Middle School, at Don Mills and Overlea, is much like any other TDSB facility in the inner suburbs—an unremarkable rectangle of grey, concrete blocks, plus 11 portables in the back field. It’s also one of Canada’s largest and most ethnically diverse middle schools, with approximately 1,200 students in grades 6 to 8, whose native languages include Urdu, Pashto, Dari, Bengali and Punjabi. The neighbouring streets consist mostly of strip malls and huge apartment complexes that accommodate many of the Muslim immigrants from South Asia who arrived in Toronto in large numbers in the 1990s.
A kilometre and a half away, amid the fast-food chains and electronics repair shops, is the neighbourhood’s mosque—the Darus Salaam. If you were walking by it in a hurry, you might not even realize it’s a mosque. There’s no minaret, nothing distinctive about the building; it’s just another nondescript box that disappears into the industrial landscape. The mosque is orthodox Sunni and adheres to a strict, conservative interpretation of the Quran and the teachings of the Prophet Muhammad. It is also a madrassa—a religious place of learning—for many of the children who attend Valley Park.
The majority of the students at Valley Park—more than 800 kids—are Muslims. Until 2008, several hundred of the students would leave school every Friday to attend midday prayers at the mosque. The prayer itself took only 15 to 20 minutes, but the kids wouldn’t return to school for two or three hours, if they bothered to at all. Some simply headed to a shopping mall or home to play video games. The school’s administration needed a solution.
According to TDSB policy, schools are expected to accommodate students and families who make special requests for their religion, which includes allowing time away from class and providing an appropriate location in the school for prayer. Just how exactly to achieve that accommodation is left open to a great deal of interpretation. In the case of Valley Park, one couple, Ali and Shamiza Baig, took control of the situation.
The Baigs were married in Hyderabad, India, in 1986. They moved to Canada a year later and eventually had three children—two sons and a daughter. Ali is 52 years old and owns an electrical business, and Shamiza, who is 50, runs a home daycare. They are both highly devout Muslims and attend prayer at Darus Salaam. They are also devoted parents and extremely proud of their children. One son has graduated from U of T, the second is studying there now, and their daughter is headed there, too.
Eleven years ago, when Shamiza’s eldest son was still a student at Valley Park, she began to organize a series of prayers at the school during the holy month of Ramadan, when Muslims are required to fast from sunrise to sunset. With the school’s consent, a few hundred students participated in the congregational prayers once a week.
Canada’s education system is very Christian, one of the Muslim parents says, and it’s up to us to challenge it
In 2008, the Baigs realized they could expand the congregational prayer program and perhaps solve the Friday exodus problem. They approached Nickolas Stefanoff, the school’s principal, and requested that a prayer session be held every Friday in the cafeteria from November to March—the months in the Islamic calendar when prayer coincides with class time. All the school had to do was provide the space and ask the parents of participating students to sign a consent form. The Baigs, the mosque and the Muslim community would take care of the rest. The school agreed.
A group of parent volunteers, all women, started to come to the school after lunch, clear the cafeteria and roll carpets out on the floor. Then three to four hundred students shuffle in. The prayers are conducted entirely in Arabic, which is the custom in just about every mosque in every corner of the world. Once the prayers are completed, the students return to class, missing only a fraction of the lesson time that they would have if they went to the mosque.
The prayer sessions occurred without scrutiny until last July, when the Toronto Sun ran a series of stories about Valley Park. The newspaper was especially exercised about the fact that an imam from Darus Salaam was leading the prayers in the school’s cafeteria, and that the girls were being made to sit behind the boys.
Political blogs picked up the Sun story and gave it momentum on Twitter, dubbing the service the “mosqueteria.” The controversy grew more intense when the Toronto Star printed a photo of the prayer session and the Star columnist Heather Mallick criticized the school for allowing girls to be treated as inferior.
Most of the journalists emphasized one detail that secular Canadians found particularly objectionable: any girl who was menstruating couldn’t participate in the prayers, and could only observe from the back row. Orthodox Muslims, like members of a number of other faiths, consider menstruating females impure for religious functions.
A few moderate Muslim activists, such as Farzana Hassan, the former president of the Muslim Canadian Congress, began to ask why a public institution was hosting a religious prayer service in the first place. Other MCC members asked why the school wasn’t supervising what the imam was preaching to the students. Hassan claimed that the Sunni interpretation of Islam alienates the children of other Muslim sects.
The furor over the cafeteria prayers was all the louder because it was perceived as a slippery slope, part of a pattern of controversial accommodations of Muslim culture and religion in Canada. Gender segregation may happen in mosques in this country, but the idea that it was happening—and going unchallenged—in a place of education appeared to be a violation of the Education Act and the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. At Valley Park, the school’s administration had entered into a simple deal with Muslim parents and students. It never anticipated an explosive reaction.
I grew up in a progressive, moderate Muslim home. I was born in Karachi but spent most of my childhood in Saudi Arabia, where the strict Wahhabi interpretation of Islam was enforced. My father is Sunni and my mother a Shia, and they brought my sister and me up with an appreciation for our religious identity as well as a respect for secular principles. We moved to Canada in 1987, and over the past 10 years I have watched with mounting concern the rise of religious fundamentalism in the country that is now my home. The congregational prayer sessions at Valley Park seemed to be another expression of that conservative faith.
When I phoned Nickolas Stefanoff and asked him how he was dealing with the complaints about the prayer service, he responded defensively. He instructed me to learn something about Islam before I start asking questions. When I told him that I was a Muslim, he backed down, but remained resolute that the school was doing nothing wrong. I asked if I could attend one of the prayer services, and he said yes.
On the mild December Friday that I drove to Valley Park, I saw mothers in niqabs walking their children to school. Outside Stefanoff’s office were posters announcing the upcoming holiday season concert. The school’s Christmas tree was decorated with snowmen and snowflakes—nothing overtly religious. Stefanoff is 61 years old. He’s a tall man with an expressive face. His own family is Eastern Orthodox, and he recalls how, when he was a boy, women had to sit apart from the men during church services and cover their heads. They are no longer required to do so, and he offers this as an example of how religious traditions can evolve. He predicts the Muslim community at Don Mills and Overlea will evolve one day, too.
Just after the lunch hour, Stefanoff escorted me to the school’s cafeteria to see the prayer service. Valley Park’s custodians were moving the tables and benches to make room for the students to pray on the floor. One by one, six female parent volunteers came in. The one woman who wasn’t already wearing a hijab quickly pulled a scarf out of her purse and wrapped her head as she got closer to the stage. I sat down beside a volunteer with a pleasant smile and an open face. Her name was Sumaira Tariq, and she has a son in Grade 6 at Valley Park. Her other son graduated last year and now attends Marc Garneau, the neighbouring high school. She told me that she believes Friday prayer is not a matter of choice, but a duty. She said that the first question God will ask Muslims when they die is whether or not they prayed, and the most important day of the week is Friday, which is why it’s so important for her sons to fulfill this responsibility to Him. Tariq also has a daughter who is a student at Marc Garneau, and she is insistent that, in Islam, boys and girls must not be permitted to stand together during prayers. “This is the teaching of Islam—and it must not be questioned,” she said.
Shamiza Baig, the woman who helped start the prayer sessions at Valley Park, entered the room with a burst of energy and excitement. She’s short, plump and boisterous, with glasses tightly fastened by the hijab wrapped around her head. She arrived just when the students began to enter the cafeteria. Boys and girls entered through separate doors—boys from the front, near the stage, girls through the back.
Several of the girls were in long black robes. But many wore jeans, T-shirts, sweatshirts. All wore a hijab except for one tiny girl in a purple long-sleeved T-shirt and black jeans with bedazzled back pockets. There was a bit of panic among the parent volunteers because her curly black hair was exposed. They scrambled to find her an extra scarf. The girl herself had a laissez-faire attitude to the whole thing, and when she wandered over to the front area where the boys pray, two parent volunteers ordered her to go to the back of the room with the other girls. Finally a scarf was given to her, and she found her place with the other girls.
The children removed their shoes and kneeled on the carpets in neat rows. Students at the school wear ID tags around their necks but tuck them into their shirts during prayer. Baig ran the prayer like a tight military operation, issuing orders for students to get organized and finish their sunnahs—a specific series of prayers to be recited before the formal sermon begins. She asked a group of girls who were sitting on benches to immediately get on the floor and join the other girls.
The sermon commenced and the parent volunteers stood at strategic spots around the room to catch any misbehaviour. They recited the same prayer I’ve heard thousands of times over my lifetime. There is only one God, and Muhammad is his prophet. I watched as the students bowed and kneeled and looked side to side—the ritual movements of Muslim prayers performed all over the world.
After the prayers ended, the cafeteria erupted into chaos. Girls gossiped and screamed, boys rough-housed, and no one seemed in a hurry to get back to class. It was a little like Lord of the Flies. I remembered something Stefanoff told me: “They are kids before they are Muslims.”
Stefanoff was dumbfounded by the controversy over the prayers when it began last summer. He assured me that the school isn’t teaching religion and no students are pressured to attend. The school is simply providing the space, and the administration doesn’t have anything to do with the prayer itself. He blames the controversy on a little-known organization called Canadian Hindu Advocacy, and the group’s director, Ron Banerjee.
Banerjee is a lanky 43-year-old with a pronounced lisp and a nervous energy. He has been the full-time director of the organization for its three-year existence and claims to have 930 paying members. He describes himself as a religious moderate but a political conservative. He backed Stephen Harper and Rob Ford during their campaigns, and he frequently issues statements condemning government policies, in Canada and India, that supposedly show favouritism toward Muslims.
Banerjee claims he started to receive emails in early 2011 from half a dozen parents of Hindu students at Valley Park who had complaints about the school prayers. (He said he couldn’t show me the emails—they’d been deleted.) The parents said they didn’t like the special accommodations the school was making for the Muslim students, in part because it was disruptive to the whole school. They said their own kids’ education was being compromised every Friday. The hundreds of students returning late to classes meant that teachers spent too much class time repeating lessons. One parent claimed that many children couldn’t settle down once they returned to class, and it was difficult to carry out the lessons. Friday afternoons were basically a write-off for every student—Muslim or non-Muslim.
Banerjee claims the TDSB bends over backwards to accommodate Muslims above all other groups, and he has been criticized as an Islamophobe for saying so. When I asked him if he considers himself Islamophobic, he became annoyed but didn’t deny it. (There’s enough evidence of his contempt for Muslims in a video posted in 2010 on the CHA website. “In its entire history,” he says, “the Islamic civilization has invented and contributed less to human advancement than a pack of donkeys.”)
Banerjee encouraged the parents to ask Stefanoff to stop the prayers, but he doesn’t know if any of them followed through. After the Sun story appeared, he sent an email to the TDSB expressing his concerns about the prayers. A month later, he received a reply from the TDSB stating that the prayers were not inappropriate and reiterating the board’s policy of religious accommodation.
Banerjee organized a coalition that included members of the Jewish Defense League and the Christian Heritage Party, and scheduled three protests at the TDSB head office at Yonge and Sheppard. Several hundred people participated in the demonstrations and counter-demonstrations. Banerjee arranged for a series of people to deliver speeches opposing the board’s accommodation policy at the protests. (The only Muslim to speak was the journalist and women’s rights activist Raheel Raza. She was heckled by a group of young Muslim men and women, who criticized her for betraying her own religion.)
Jim Spyropoulos, the superintendent of the TDSB’s Equitable and Inclusive Schools department, kept a wary eye on the protests. Spyropoulos is a former high school principal, and he took the equity job in 2010, when it was created. He told me that the school was faced with a difficult decision about using the cafeteria for prayers. He says most of the time, when requests for prayer services arise at other schools, solutions are found for individual students. According to Spyropoulos, these types of prayers—congregational and individual—are being accommodated at hundreds of schools within the TDSB, though usually in small, multi-faith prayer rooms. The board’s policy does not distinguish between individual requests and group requests—and in the case of Valley Park it was the responsibility of the school to accommodate a large group. The cafeteria was the only practical solution.
Both Spyropoulos and Stefanoff insist that not one parent or student at Valley Park has come to them to complain. By making the cafeteria available for prayer, the school is in compliance with the board policy, which is based on the human rights codes for Ontario and Canada. “To me there is no issue here,” Stefanoff says.
The TDSB made one concession to the protesters, when it agreed that it was inappropriate for an imam from Darus Salaam to lead the prayer in the school. The school asked that the prayer session be led instead by senior students from Marc Garneau. The volunteer Muslim parents vet the students for religious training. Stefanoff feels better about this, he says, because they are former Valley Park students and he knows they are “good kids.”
Some of the prayer sessions’ critics, including Farzana Hassan and Raheel Raza, claim they have no problem with Islam. Rather, they’re concerned that the school is allowing students to be indoctrinated with a conservative Sunni ideology. Stefanoff waves off that concern, too, and says he trusts his community and the volunteers and doesn’t believe anything inappropriate is happening.
To Banerjee, it isn’t good enough for the principal to say that all they do is provide the space and that they aren’t teaching religion—the school cannot take a hands-on, hands-off approach. If the school is allowing gender segregation during the prayer sessions, it’s a tacit endorsement of that practice. For Banerjee and for many others, it’s an endorsement of conservative Islam.
On New Year’s Day, I met Ali and Shamiza Baig at a Tim Hortons in one of the many strip malls in their neighbourhood. Ali did most of the talking. He told me that he has friends at every mosque in the city, and that they are working together to support the school prayer sessions. He said that Canada’s education system is very Christian and nobody challenges it.
Ali Baig, like Stefanoff, blames the debate over the prayer sessions on a small group of people. He wonders if the controversy erupted when it did because of the then-ongoing provincial election—was someone trying to embarrass the Liberals? Shamiza laughed and said that it’s only Islamophobes who have a problem with the prayers.
When I asked the Baigs why the Valley Park girls must sit behind the boys, Ali said that it isn’t something they actively enforce at the school: the students are merely following what they learn at the mosque. I asked what would happen if one of the female students demanded to sit in the front, and Shamiza replied that none has. I pushed the point: what if, one day, one girl wants to sit in the front? Shamiza said she would explain to the girl that that’s not the way it’s done in Islam. The boys must be in the front, and girls belong in the back. Ali said the girls choose to sit in the back because they’re concerned about a “biological scenario.” When I asked for clarification, he explained that a girl praying in the front might “disrupt the prayers” because the boys would be distracted. (Even the Baigs’ own daughter once told the school at a community meeting that she preferred to sit in the back of prayer sessions because she didn’t want the boys looking at her.) I noted that boys and girls sit next to each other in class, but Ali insisted that classes and prayers are different. Plus, under the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, he said, they have the right to practise their religion as they see fit.
Critics of the prayer session fixated on the fact that menstruating girls aren’t allowed to participate and can only observe from the back row
During a lull in the conversation, I asked why Shamiza had been so silent. What happened to the military general from the prayers? She told me she wants her husband to take the lead. She said it’s best to let the men be in charge. Ali interrupted and said that it’s just an act, and she’s really the one who runs the show. “I’m just a backbencher,” he said.
After we finished our coffee, the Baigs were heading to the Darus Salaam and I decided to tag along. The mosque was less than a five-minute walk from the Tim Hortons, and on the way, the Baigs ran into half a dozen acquaintances who were heading to the same place. When we got there, Ali went up the front steps and Shamiza and I walked to the side of the building, toward the so-called sisters’ entrance. Not only were we not permitted to enter through the front doors, we were also segregated from the men. The sisters-only room is about 20 feet by 10. It’s carpeted, with one broken shelf containing books on Islam. Shamiza pointed out that the students use some of these same books to recite prayers at the school on Fridays. There were a couple of posters on the wall with prayers in Arabic, and a clock at the front. The women are supposed to be able to hear the prayers in the main space through speakers, but there was no sound coming through. Instead, I could hear men on the other side of the wall laughing, joking and talking loudly. It was difficult to tell what was happening. Shamiza kneeled down and started to pray. I sat there, frustrated that I couldn’t find out what was happening on the other side.
When the prayer ended, I said goodbye to Shamiza and left the mosque. The Baigs, I decided, are likable and seem well-meaning, but I don’t share their unconditional acceptance of Islamic customs. What they’re doing at Valley Park sets a dangerous precedent and legitimizes sexism. The school may be following a policy of accommodating special requests, but there’s a striking difference between designating a room for a handful of students and converting the largest room in the building for group prayer. The school becomes, in effect, a mosque.
In accordance with the Muslim calendar, Valley Park’s weekly Friday prayer sessions ended for the year on March 9. Later this year, on November 9, they’ll be back in the cafeteria.
“The prayer itself took only 15 to 20 minutes, but the kids wouldn’t return to school for two or three hours, if they bothered to at all”…
SO THIS IS HOW IT CAME ABOUT? MANY OF THE MUSLIM KIDS WERE TRUANT… AND NOT GOING BACK TO CLASS. SO TRUANCY RULES DO NOT NEED TO BE FOLLOWED BECAUSE OF RELIGION?
This is an issue with the Muslim kids parents. They should be able to attend prayer, in the mosque for 15-20 and then GO BACK TO SCHOOL… the school should not be turned into a MOSQUE to ensure the kids do what they are supposed to do (by law!!!) and attend school!!!
Exactly. I’m under 30 and know that even in my day cutting class meant consequences (from the school and my folks). Both are failing in this instance.
School is a place to learn not a place to practice faith. Prayer of any faith should not be part of the public school system. World Religions as a course should be however.
Wake up world!!! All i have to say is we told you so.
(an israeli girl)
But having a day off (sunday) for christians to pray is ok ? This is our religious and we have to stick to its rules. You dont have the authority to stop muslims to attend their prayer. Every person has his rights to do their relgious rituals. People are just ignorant and if they work their mind a little bit and know what islam is; theyll know that it is the PERFECT relgion :).
No-one should be castigated for practicing their religion. It seems to me the school found a sensible solution to the problem created by students failing to re-appear after Friday prayers at the nearby mosque. It’s a tribute to Canada’s acceptance of other races and faiths that, in a school with a muslim majority, the desires of many were accommodated so readily.
What is worrying is the inability of many in the muslim community to mirror that flexibility. Canada is a secular country and the school timetable is not built around prayer times. There may be times when it is not possible to pray because a class is in session. There is nothing wrong with waiting for a later opportunity and offering the prayer qazar (late). Muslims are not required to disrupt entire classes to publicise their piety.
With regard to segregation, there should be a choice. The physical nature of Islamic prayer is such that women may be more comfortable at the rear of the same room. But it should be their decision. If women choose to pray amongst men, it is up to both to have pure intentions and the onus is on both to concentrate on their prayer. It is unfair to place the burden of male distraction solely on women. There is absolutely no reason to have separate rooms.
Anywhere groups of people come together to pray, careful consideration needs to be given to what is being preached to guard against political and religious indoctrination.
As muslims living in a secular country, it is our duty to comply with the laws of the land and fit our cultural and religious needs around those. If that fails there is always the option of sacrificing that freedom in favour of living in a country where there is no choice.
Females do not just sit behind males when praying they pray as well if they want to pray as group (Jama’a)
Westerns are very considerate!
While in the Islamic countries, non-muslims are being ignored and insulted, and the Saudi Mufti requests all churches in the arabian peninsula to be destroyed, Westerns and trying to find solutions for muslim students to pray? Seriously?
Schools are not mosques and if that doesn’t suit you, go back to your home country :-D
Hijab (Veil) should also be forbidden in public schools!
Western world shoul be careful against these muslims. in the name of freedom they want to go religious even in public. but when they become majority, they don’t allow others to do the same. In muslim counrties they never care about non-muslims’ freedom or religion.. they want all only for themself… they are dangerous!…
NO RELIGION IN PULIC SCHOOLS….PERIOD.
If you want madrassas pay for them yourselves and not with my tax dollars.
I think people commenting on this subject don’t really understand the prayer requirement for Muslims. You are required to pray 5 times a day (the times correlate to the suns rotation). When I went to a public school (that was predominately Jewish, mind you) I excused myself from class, found an empty classroom and prayed. No one knew, and if they did there was no problem with it. I don’t see the issue with this, are we not a nation that allows its citizens to express themselves religiously openly and freely?
There is a level of bigotry that runs through many of these comments. Our tax dollars support many religious private schools, and the public school facilities are used by many different religions, but primarily Christians. And each of these religions carries a level of sexism in the context of western liberal democratic principles. We fund Catholic schools where only men may become priests, and many of the Christian schools teach anti-homosexual material. As an atheist who grew up in the public school system having to listen to the class recite the Lord’s prayer each day, I find the criticism of holding Muslim prayers in this school to be the height of hypocrisy. The same level of scrutiny is simply not leveled at the other religious groups. While I oppose all forms of discrimination toward women, many people who accept it in other places in our society, suddenly find a new fervor to oppose it when they see it in the Muslim community. And that is a fact.
As a real Atheist I don’t want any religion in public schools.
As a teacher, I can tell you that this school’s secular schedule is being completely disrupted by these prayers. Did anyone notice the stage in that “cafeteria?” It’s now off limits to the drama teacher, the English teacher, the music teacher or any other large group wanting to do some kind of large group activity on Friday afternoons. This is already an overcrowded school!
These are tax payer resources – including the salaries of custodians and the transportation to get to the school by students – that is being used to fund one religion over another. As a teacher, anyone who thinks the school has not co-opted the teachers is dreaming.
Not to mention….what is happening in the public sphere to girls is heinous. And don’t tell me these kids are not being forced. What’s the principal going to do when the parents want the kid to go but the kid says no?? Taxpayers, are you paying for this????? Yes you are!
Shame on the TDSB. Shame on Canadian multiculturalism! These are NOT Canadian values at work. Bring on the law suits!
The Muslim students at Valley park are not required to pray during school hours. They can do so after school. The core culture of Canada is Christian,the laws that we obey are based on that. The fact that the education system has become relative instead of the historical reality. Canadian culture must be the starting point since it is a fact of our history.
I regularly and frequently attended Church events after school hours and in the evening.I was not allowed to attend during school hours unless it was a family funeral. These students should be disciplined for not returning to class,by the school and the parents. It is inappropriate for the school to be providing religious services and directly against Canadian values for the parents to let their kids do this.
Unfortunately, education is not take a priority in Islam but taking advantage of every progressive silliness, is in the Qur’an. Take tour kids to Mosque after school hours,we don’t pay for this nonsense.
Multiculturalism is a curse on Canadian society. We can see the effects in Europe. Ghettos are not a Canadian value. We have accepted into our fabric a culture and community that does not want to be Canadian. Some of them want to make Canada into the place they ran away to get a better life from. It is not acceptable. You chose to come here, accept the reality of Canada or choose to go somewhere else where you will be happier.
“As an atheist who grew up in the public school system having to listen to the class recite the Lord’s prayer each day,…..”
What an assault on the intellect and the senses that was! Must be traumatised for life.
By the way have you ever heard of Blairs Law: “The phenomenon of far right and far left groups allying with extremist Islamists is called “Blair’s Law [sic]” (“the ongoing process by which the world’s multiple idiocies are becoming one giant, useless force” by conservative and libertarian bloggers
The only aspect of any relevance regarding this issue is being completely ignored. Parents can want these Friday prayer services all they want and the TDSB can reference it’s accommodation policy as much as it likes. Neither are relevant as the fact is these prayer services are in direct violation of both the Education Act and the Charter. They are in violation of the law.
Do no editors at this publication check comments for possible hate speech? Some of the comments on this article are discriminatory enough to come pretty close. I practice no religion, come from a Canadian family of many generations, and I think it’s the most Canadian value of all to allow everyone to peacefully co-exist with their own customs and values, as long as it’s not hurting anyone else. How does praying to their particular deity affect any of you who are commenting on this board, I wonder? If you have some misguided idea that Muslims (or whoever practices a faith) are out to ‘convert’ people because they happen to pray, then your grasp of logic is extremely tenuous, indeed. I used to think smart, educated people were the readers of this magazine. Clearly I was mistaken, if comments like these — and, to be honest, such a poorly-written story (that really doesn’t have much of a point at all) — are any indication.
Katherine, at what point do you suppose we stop submitting to values that are not considered desirable? Do you think it’s OK in a publicly funded school to single out menstruating girls and shove them at the back of the room because they’re najis (unclean). You’re Ok with your tax dollars supporting that humiliation? Would you consider my objections hate speech, also?
Steve, are you really so concerned about these girls who are following a common Muslim tradition? I find it hard to believe your apparent outrage in this matter is really that serious. Do you have the slightest evidence that any girl at Valley Park feels oppressed by engaging in this tradition, or is forced to engage in it if they don’t want to? And more to the point, do you have any evidence that any girls were “singled out” by anyone other than themselves? Were there any “menstruation police” (“Creedy 60 year old imams” as Ron Banarjee put it) present examining these girls in any way? I have seen or heard no evidence of this, beyond the totally unsubstantiated claims of Banarjee and Raheel Raza, neither of whom was questioned by the ideologues who had them on their shows or included them in their youtube videos.
It is a very sad to me to see such blatant disregard for the fact the level of disregard certain religions have for the fact that they have chosen to reside in a democratic, largely christian society and do not wish to acknowledge these facts at all with such disrespect. As far as I am concerened Canadians should get rid of multiculturalism as it has not worked anywhere on this planet for very good reasons! As some have indicated there are many Muslim countries where pple are being murdured for following Christian religion and yet we here are foolishly being requred to make concessions to accomodate them.
One planet, one species of Homo Erectus (us, people), so, why so many different religions? Multi nationalities, there for multi, man made, religions. So, what is the result of having all these religions? Check history; most of all conflicts and wars are caused by religious people and their rulers!!!!! Is this what we teach our children (religion) so they can continue to hate and kill? Try to be non belonging free thinker, see if you will have enemies. Political example; Switzerland is and was neutral, there for no enemies.
Okay, so I read the article and all the comments.
I must say, the amount of ignorance presented in the article and some of these comments is astounding.
Firstly, the problem: Kids not returning to school after their prayers. This of course is a bad thing, and of course has nothing to do with religion.
It’s just children skipping school when they have an opportunity to do so – kids being kids. I would have suggested have someone supervise them from the school or even talk to the mosque, and make sure that they get back to school after prayers. If they then want to go back to the mosque for religious lessons, then they are free to do so but not on the school’s time.
This I believe, was the first error. Yet they decided for a different solution of having prayers at the school, which i don’t completely agree with but okay, fine, lets say the solution I suggested was not possible.
First, let me quickly explain certain things about prayer.
Muslims are instructed to pray 5 times a day. This they can do alone or in congregation, and can be done almost anywhere (within reason of course – you’re not going to be praying in a strip club for example)
On Friday, the second prayer becomes an obligatory congregation for men, however it is optional for women – if they choose to attend the congregation then they can. Before the prayer there is usually a short lesson on a certain concept of Islam, or tell a certain story about someone (and how we can learn from it) or about a certain event or incident and what Islam’s point of view is on this event.
So back to the article. What the school decided to do based on some parents’ suggestion was to hold the prayer in school. So okay, they decided to do this, yet the rest of the school had problems on friday afternoons because the muslims were taking up their room every single friday. Obviously this solution was not ideal and not fair. Once they finished praying they immediately started laughing/playing etc. This is also one of the disadvantages of having the prayer at the school. A mosque should be like a library. You don’t play around and joke loudly in a library because you might disturb other people who are reading. Same thing in a mosque. They knew they were at school, and thus they treated it that way – in class if the teacher goes out of the class for a second, the kids would immediately start talking and playing; it’s natural.
So this solution was incorrect.
However, then the article suddenly mentions the critics saying that menstruating women have to ‘sit in the back and not participate, and are singled out’. This is a biased perspective. Menstruating women are exempt from these prayers, and they are not obliged to compensate for them later. But by no means should they be singled out and treated any differently. This ‘sitting at the back’ was merely the choice of the teachers, and not the teachings of Islam.
Then, the problem with ‘girls sitting at the back’. It has nothing to do with girls being inferior. Having the girls section right next to the boys section at the front, and separated by a divider, would also work. This is merely so that during prayer, the boys can’t stare at the womens’ bodies and vice versa, to avoid any sexual feelings and minimize distractions in prayer. They did not have a divider and opted for women to sit at the back, so that during prayer when everyone is bowing, the boys do not have an opportunity to stare at the girls’ behinds.
As for what is being taught by the imams before the prayer, I believe that, if they choose to continue this (which i do not believe they should) the school has a right to know what is being taught. The imam should discuss with the school what is prepared for the friday “lesson”, and this lesson can even be done in a way that is beneficial to the school children (e.g. lessons about the importance of learning, and how highly god views a person who seeks education).
As for the rest of the prayers, perhaps provide a 5 minute break between classes for the students who want to go pray, or at the very least allow the students to be excused in between classes for that.
Long story short, this is a string of bad decisions and misconceptions, further fueled by the media.
For Some perspective regarding the sexism claims, as well as the importance of education in Islam:
http://www.minhaj.org/english/tid/8535/Women-Education-in-Islam-article-by-dr-raheeq-ahmad-rahiq-ahmed-abbasi-nazim-e-aala-mqi-minhaj-ul-quran.html
Peace :)
This is how this crap spreads so insiduously.
Now Scarborough hospital is eliminating pork from the menu and all meat will be halal… you guessed it… to satisfy it’s muslim patients.
http://www.thestar.com/living/food/recipes/article/1149469–scarborough-hospital-plans-to-serve-patients-food-that-s-delicious-local-and-made-from-scratch
One day we will all wake up and wonder where the Canada we loved went.
Here are a few facts that Toronto Life decided were not worth sharing with its readers.
1. Natasha Fatah is the daughter of Tarek Fatah, the founder of the Muslim Canadian Congress — a group that puports to speak for “liberal” Muslims
2. The MCC was among the groups protesting the TDSB last summer, alongside the Jewish Defence League, the Christian Heritage Party and Hindu Advocacy. What charming company.
So Natasha gets to write a “dispassionate” account about this controversy even though Dad’s group was leading the protests. Can you say “conflict of interest?”
Remember the old saying about journalistic ethics being an oxymoron?
Natasha Fatah is a grown up woman who lives independently and is entitled to her own opinions.
Apart from trying to shoot the messenger, do you have anything really relevant to add ?
And why use the nickname Neil when you’re probably a Mohammed ?
Oh she’s entitled to her opinion, alright. I just want to know about her conflicts of interest when she conducts a supposedly “objective” investigation into a public controversy.
So sorry that you’re losing “beloved” Canada; the sooner people of your ilk disappear with it, the better.
And my name is Neil just as surely as your name is not “Woody”.
I do not think that these prayers in the classroom add to the multuralism of Canada in the way that multiculturalism was intended. I have many muslim friends and many of them have told me that women are constantly in fear of being labelled promiscious and opinionated. The fact that sexist behaviour is being institutionalized in public schools in such a clear manner is absolutely abhorrent. Women all over the world are fighting to become 100% equal to men in all ways. These prayer habits are essentially forcing women to become second class citizens. It is not possible that this can happen in Canada. Human rights legislation and equality under the law is a valued Canadian virtue. It is one thing to have these prayer habits be practised in a mosque which is subject to whatever religious customs are accepted, but to have it in a school? where at the very least, girls should be free from discrimination and bigotry. Girls cannot pray with the men when they are menstruating. I think this sums it all.
I am looking forward to the day when more and more women stand up for themselves and claim their right to practice their religion in the same way as men. Why not let men wear a burka and a hijab? Shouldn’t modesty also be practised by men as well?
Author Natasha Fatah is the daughter of Tarek Fatah?
If so it is downright embarassing that Toronto Life didn’t note this.
Same as how they didn’t note the connection between the Editor and the author of the Layton piece.
Come on Toronto Life!
This is ridiculous – atheists don’t get to ditch class to celebrate not believing in God. Religion belongs in the home, and in its proper places of worship. All that forcing these issues into a PUBLIC school system does is push the divide between differing belief systems even further apart.
Not to mention that the religion in question is unbelievably sexist, and homophobic – teaching poor tolerance and values to children in their formative years. I don’t think we’d be having this debate over Buddhism, because the truth is that a history of killing your wives, daughters, and gay family members doesn’t really sit well with the general population in Canada – as it shouldn’t.
Why school closed in Saturday and Sunday ? Why not in Monday or Wednesday ? Saturday is Sabbath day according to Jaws and Christian and Sunday, you all know is the Church day. So, how can it fit in secular country?
There is nothing secular in this world.
Nothing wrong to accommodate Muslim students in Muslim majority school in a country which actually not secular. Please go through constitution of Canada; which started with praising God.
Kids everywhere get to skip class for various reasons – sports, drama, school-related stuff, non-school related stuff, day trips, family vacations, religious requirements (Christian and non-Christian.) Why it only matters when it is Muslim kids that do it is beyond me.
This is the best and no 1 peaceful country in the world. The law of this country is so soft than the others. If you open your eyes and see the rules of middle east countries and the other Muslim countries, they were never give any chances to the other religions. because of the kindness of the law and the equal rights , the Muslims are taking the advantage from canada. please keep in your mind, 20 or 30 years later muslims will start to make too much troubles to this country.
i am a pure roman catholic and i feel so bad about our childrens in the future.
Canada must be strict to these Muslims.
In my opinion, occupying the largest space in the public school by a religious group does not constitute “reasonable” accommodation. Doing so during the class time is specifically prohibited by the Ontario Education Act.
The School can make a reasonable accommodation by allowing the students to leave the school premises for their Friday religious activity just as any other students can be excused from class for whatever reason.
The Principal of Valley Park, Jim Spyropoulos claims that he has received NO complaints from either parents or students. Well, that cannot be true as I know of one family who did complain but received no response. Did Spyropoulos ever consider the feeling of non-Muslim students as well as Muslim students who do not belong to the same conservative Sunni sect of Islam or those do not wish to take part in the prayer. How do they feel about having no access to their cafeteria, or the washroom on that floor (as I’ve been informed) reserved only for participating Muslim students during that time?
Section 29 of the Education Act reads:
1) A board shall not permit any person to conduct religious exercises, or to provide instruction that includes religious indoctrination in a particular religion or religious belief in a school.
2) Religious instruction can occur so long as attendance is optional the program is not sponsored or provided by the Board, and does not take place during instruction time;
3) The Board making use of this provision, must consider all such requests on an equitable basis.
There is so much truth to every comment written so far. The issue I see is not only segregation of male and females, but segregation of other students. By allowing such a large number of students to take part in group religious practices during school hours you are keeping them apart from students of other faiths. You are encouraging the divide between muslim and non-muslim students. Public schools are meant to bring students of all nationalities and faiths together. If you want to have a religious based school, or one where children study and pray at different times, send your children to a private school.
Religion is not = to education. In Canada we teach our children to work together. Male and female, muslim and jew, chinese and japanese. We teach facts. We do not indoctrinate. We should not be looking at the convenience of praying around school hours. If you want to live in Canada and send your children to Canadian public schools than you should embrace the standardization of these schools as they represent the fact that all students are treated equally.
Human rights laws are there to protect the citizens of Canada, not to assist individual efforts against assimilation.
I wonder if the school would allow “Life is wasted without Jesus” shirts?
this is Canada, LOOK AROUND,
I (A Canadian) was kicked out of a PUBLIC SWIMMING place because there was a group of women in the pool that were not allowed to be seen by males, they closed the doors and put paper on all the windows to stop anyone from looking in, wake up people, its 2012, who gives a rat ass what you look like in a bathing suit! if you dont like swimming with other people thats YOUR PROBLEM not MINE! PUBLIC MEANS PUBLIC! if you dont like it Get your own private pool and do what you want!
In response to Kazal’s statement: yes, of course the Sunday weekend schedule is based on the sensibilities of Christians. The American and Canadian governments were founded mostly by Christians, so there are some Christian traditions mixed into the government and culture, although the government is mostly secular (and has been becoming more secular for the past 100 years).
Since it is necessary to have a collective weekend schedule for public schools (unlike private schools & private businesses), the weekend schedule obviously uses the tradition followed by the largest number of people, even if many of the people are now atheists and it is only a “holdover” from Christian tradition.
Any country expects people to follow some cultural traditions of the majority. For example, let’s look at some mixed-Muslim countries like Egypt and Jordan, where there is approximately 10% Christians. BUT in these countries, public school students, whether Christian or Muslim, follow THE MUSLIM-CULTURAL SCHOOL SYSTEM WHERE THE WEEKEND IS FRIDAY, NOT SUNDAY. There are approximately 2-3% Muslims in Canada, so of course public schools follow THE CHRISTIAN-CULTURAL SYSTEM WHERE THE WEEKEND IS SUNDAY. If I moved to Egypt and married a Coptic Egyptian, I would not expect the Egyptian school system to let our children get Sundays off, obviously, so it is equally unrealistic for Muslims to expect to get Friday off in a public school in the US. If that is important to us, we would choose a private school.
America isn’t a 100% secular country, it is true it’s built on the traditions of Christians. But it’s more secular than most countries, so your comparison is misleading.
My point is, it is unrealistic to pretend that any country, no matter how secular it is, should be free from the cultural traditions of the majority group(s) who founded, or currently live in, the country. Turkey is a country with a secular constitution but, like the US, it has public holidays based on religious days.
I really don’t understand why this is such a big issue. I’m agnostic myself, fitting quite decidedly in the “I don’t know” category when it comes to matters of religion. But at the same time, I feel it is everyone’s right to have the freedom to practice their faith as long as they don’t push that faith on others.
Since they are excusing themselves from class to go and pray by them selves and not intruding on others, I really don’t see why this should cause such heated debate. whereas not so long ago the lord’s prayer was forced on students who may not have not have shared the christian faith and the Christian groups were in an uproar when the custom was removed from the schools.
I would not be offended if a Muslim wished me a happy Ramadan or if a Christian wished me a merry Christmas so long as the intent was genuine. I think if people stopped taking offence to each other’s beliefs and adopted a more enlightened live and let live philosophy, we would have fewer issues in the world.
Hate, it appears, is spread more virulently by those who profess to be free of it.
where is this controversy at this time? (August 2012).
I agree with many comments that say public schools are for public consumption.
You want to pray on Friday? Go to a Muslim school.
Don’t disrupt public education.
You want to learn about Islam?
Take a religion course and learn about other religions as well.
Bravo To Natasha Fatah for writing this piece.
When will people wise up and realize that the Muslim people are out to rule the world, and will unless the peaceful people of the world get together and realize this is a real threat. Do you think all germans were war like?30% how about the chinese or the japanese,or any other peaceful countries? all stood by and were drawn into war by the minority of war mongers. Just do nothing and we will all have nothing. Listen and watch these muslim dictators. KILL KILL all the non belivers. 10 years from now look back on this day, and say, i should have done more. Beware of people that have 6,8,10, 12,14 16, kids and can’t afford them. It is to rule the world but live on welfare first. why do we allow them to do anything they want?
at the beginning they fight to cancel the christian prayers from schools and second step :to fight having the right to have the muslim prayers everywhere starting from schools and universities and everywhere else. give me a break
Thats what they want ,their plan to change the western world to be under islamic sharia allah and dominate by increasing in number of population.
wake up world,,,,,wake up .we will be ruled and live in an islamic country by time,,,,watch out.
North America should treat Muslims just like Austrila. This is a Christian country. If you don’t like the rules here, please go back to where you came from.
@ Muslim girl: did you hear any Christians complain in the middle east about not getting Sunday off. So please do not bend the rules just for you. If you don’t get your way, you always complain. Please learn to adapt and live by the rules of the country you immigrated to or go back to where you came from.
How did our CHRISTIAN Nation succumb to not only BANNING Christian prayers, but now allowing NON-CHRISTIAN Prayers in PUBLIC Schools???
WHAT IS HAPPENING, CANADA?
We are on the verge of losing our culture.
“O’Canada, our home and Muslim land…..”
If you want Friday off for praying you should live in a Muslim country. Christians or Jews in Muslim countries are not given their religious day off and will never get it even if asked for it . So stop being greedy. Your religion should stay at home and you should worry about education not praying all day.. And I’m talking about any religion ! Enough is enough
This is Canada’s CONSTITUTION ACT, 1982 (80)
1982, c. 11 (U.K.), Schedule B
PART I
CANADIAN CHARTER OF RIGHTS AND FREEDOMS
Whereas Canada is founded upon principles that recognize the supremacy of God and the rule of law…………..
This means that those who are from other countries and beliefs – to bad. Deal with the fact you chose to live here. If you don’t like our policies and our religion, it’s time you leave.
Man, I’m so fed up with reading about all of this Muslim hogwash that we’re not bending to them….what gives them the right to leave a public school during class hours to not return? Their prayers will have to simply wait until they have a break – period – just like the rest of us CANADIANS now that they’ve banned the Lord’s Prayer.
Canadian’s – it’s time to take a stance. Stand up and KEEP OUR CULTURE at EVERY EXPENSE. If that means to the astonishment of another culture, so be it.
A school is meant for academics. People go to school for an education, not to pray!
mosques are for prayers, schools are for an education!
This is pathetic.
Canada-please wake up! you have your own culture and civilisation, immigrants should experience Canada if they don’t like it, then get out of here and go to Saudi Arabia where they pray 24/7.
This is the wrong country.
There are no schools in the U.S. that allow this on Fridays. The Friday prayers are performed AFTER SCHOOL hours when all other pupils have left.
As to perfect religion: islam is the only religion that KILLS anyone that leaves the islam club. Islam is the only religion that KILLS non-muslims who don’t convert or who refuse to pay the dhimmi tax. Islam is the only religion that KILLS homosexuals. Islam is the only religion that orders AMPUTATIONS, BEHEADINGS, CRUCIFIXIONS, BOILING, ROASTING, EVISCERATING ETC.
To understand islam, one must read the sira (life of your ideal man). Finally, the qur’an mentions the word ‘love’ but never in relation with humans toward each other. Only towards what allah loves or to be loved by allah…
Sorry but I don’t agree with you. Peace.
Some schools in Europe allowed this. This is one example in Germany where non-muslims are being threatened etc. It got so bad in France that hijabs were disallowed from the schools. The same situation in all Scandinavian countries. It’s called creeping sharia and Canadian better wake up.
http://www.barenakedislam.com/2013/01/30/germany-minority-students-are-being-threatened-and-harassed-in-school/
Honestly these kinds of articles mind boggle me, what I want to know is what is wrong with having prayer at school. I go to York University and they devote a place to pray its called a multi-faith center and there is a prayer room where we pray. I always wanted to know why public schools make a big deal of accommodating things for us that we end up getting in post secondary education. If education is not about praying then how come York University has a prayer room in their school. I attended here four years and use the facility so I managed to pray and get my education. They teach us in schools about religious freedom and I think by everyone being allowed the choice to pray is an excellent way of showing us that this country respects religious freedom. I am a proud Canadian and this country is all I know I came from my homeland when I was 4 which is Somalia because of a civil war. I don’t remember how my country looks so Canada is my home I wish to teach my kids that you can practice your faith and still have a good education. If you also go to Mosques (this is like our church for those who don’t know what Mosque is) men pray in the front women pray in the back and if you are a menstruating women then you shouldn’t be at the prayer room. Valley High is not practicing anything new it is doing the same thing and our faith has those rules and I accept it. My question is why can’t we practice our religion the way we want. If someone thinks its wrong then that is them their is no compulsion in religion. I choose to practice my faith and I love it and it makes a better person. I enjoy praying and as a Muslim women I am content with following the rules. Women are not inferior to men because we are rewarded equally by God. God is not unjust and as long as I know that I am equal before God then I am content, I don’t like this wave of thinking that Muslim women are oppressed and need protecting. As a proud Muslim women I am here to right wrongs, I am not oppressed and calling me a victim is an insult to those who are victim. I believe their is good and bad in everyone regardless of faith or creed. I wished people stopped pushing this idea that were oppressed because I feel oppressed being told that I am something I am not. I feel oppressed being told that because I cover I am oppressed. I chose to cover and I am happy with it. I can’t speak for everyone but allow me to demonstrate to you, that you should judge us as individuals not as collective. Don’t stereotype a group this doesn’t foster tolerance rather it fosters hate. I feel oppressed being told my faith believes women are inferior when I am Muslim women who objects to that. God has a whole chapter int the Holy Quran about Women and Another chapter on Mary if we were inferior to God then why would he write about us. In these chapters says nothing about women covering it tells us our rights such as inheritance property rights, I always wanted to know how come my religious rights are accepted in education institution such as York University where no one says don’t allow Muslims to pray yet people praying in Toronto district school boards are questioned. Is my religious rights respected only institutions that I pay for. Since I will be working contributing to tax which pays for the Toronto District school board then do I not have a say in allowing people to pray. My country back home in Somalia I never really experienced it this country is all I know and this is true for many other school children in this country. This country is where I see my future and I want people to understand or open up and not fear us just because of what we believe in. I haven’t done anything to anyone I feel shouldn’t we be innocent till guilty. If that is the case then why is everything we do seen guilty who do I hurt when I pray. I am a human and I have feelings and when so much people say so much negative things about my faith then It makes me wonder where is peoples heart don’t make me and all of us who grew up here suffer for something we haven’t done.
I so glad Canadians can spell properly. Keep it up! Don’t let your southern neighbours ruin our language.
I have a simple solution, ban all “collective worship”. And make sure you let those Mohammedans (or “Muslims” as they call them selves) know that gender apartheid shall not be accepted.
What you don’t seem to understand is that we are a SECULAR COUNTRY, which means state and religion are separated. Since public schools and secondary schools are run by the government, they must be secular. This is why we have a problem with having prayer rooms in schools because it goes against SECULARISM, an important Canadian value.
Well said!
I am grateful for my salvation when I can never be perfect no matter what I do. It’s because only One is Holy. Yet He offered me His Mercy, Grace and Forgiveness – and daily assurance in His great love. I can dress in religious clothing, but laws and rules don’t change the heart. Only One can make all things new… And so, because He lives and loves us with all our mess, wonderful organizations like Alcoholics Anonymous, health care, public education, anti-slavery – were born and shared with the world.
I live there and the pollution from the D.V.P, streets, TTC, is enough to give your child lung cancer, those buildings are managed by corrupt catholic unions, there are cockroaches, pipe leaks, water problems, detracting structures, cell phone towers, power grids and I know why so many Muslims are placed there as part of east York, north York’s Muslim population and ultimately Toronto’s biggest Muslim population.
It’s because the majority in faith of Canada- choses not to live there also ethnic diversity, multicultural society or visible minority are all labels placed on different forms of migrants – Like House man or Field man- The majority of immigrants to Canada are non-Muslims, when they say diverse they just mean different color, race, origin of Christians that live in different parts of Toronto and all over Ontario – You check out Greek Town -East York – It’s not Canadian at all, full of European Christian immigrants.
Our Gov’t funds Catholic schools, clearly there is no separation of Province and State- false claim of democracy, favoring one group over the other therefore incidents like this is just a form of equity for Muslims since so much money is spent on educating Christian Canadian who wish to be separate and yet have our tax dollars pay for them. Look at Christian school right on the other side of this school and it is funny because you can hear church choirs.
What’s really pathetic is that we have Christian immigrants who are looking at us as if we don’t belong here, we are Canadian nationals and these communities host to mostly Christian immigrants, they should go back to where the cross fly’s on their flags. They have lost their identity, culture, they have been misplaced, enslaved, converted by Europeans and it is a shame that they eat ham and beacon but maybe it’s just cause it’s the north! We are glad to have a small population of those that have retained their culture, religion and most importantly their identity. It maybe due to wars, enslavement and being inferior by those who took European identities and act to be what they are not or were not prior to being invaded, enslaved, ruled upon like Europeans did to natives. Very pathetic- for example the only Chinese or Vietnamese or even Japanese you meet here are Christians whereas prior to atomic bomb, war of the 70’s, British occupation – most of them were non-Christians so it just goes to show just how strong these Muslims are that despite being ruled or occupied by Europeans, Christianity had no influence over them and they migrate to our “homeland” with their identities intact, something we cannot say about most colored residents of Toronto. – Keep praying in public school because we are tired for paying for catholic schools which are also public in Canada!!!
Scandalous, truly scandalous. A real bums rush here. Next they’ll tell you they don’t fart.
Hide the cross’s, hide the Bibles, hide the 10 commandments, hide your heads in shame, pure shame that you must deny YOUR heritage while allowing there’s……hypocritical. A better way would be to trade days…….Christians one day, Muslings the next. They are mocking you and laughing behind our backs folks. Mocking us behind our backs.
This is so ridiculous!!
Natasha Fatah, first of all learn to respect others’ religion…using Allah in the cafeteria is so derogatory. I can’t believe that journalism has come to this extent. You have no right to comment on Islam, when you know not what it means! It is people like you in the media who gives it all wrong, just to have in more views.
Separating men from women is not sexism at all…it is simple logic… you hear it all the time, right? Two and a half men, How I met your mother and everywhere for god sake. Now, don’t tell me that you don’t understand that. It is only done so that people can focus and concentrate on prayers and not check on women! As a women I cannot comprehend why this is so difficult for you to understand!
It is every right of a Muslim man and a women to fight for his/her right. He/she has all the right to worship on time for his lord! Prayers should be allowed to be conducted in public institutions esp. schools because this is where kids spend most of their time in their lives and they should be taught their values. Makes sense??
Having an iman from Darum Salam should not be anyone’s problem. What you are saying by asking to substitute him to a school kid is like asking to bring in a high school kid instead of a phd to teach in an university (if I could get anywhere closer). Isn’t that INSANE!
It is only Islam that separates women from men as much as possible..and it makes sense..why? because Islam doesn’t only preach about not doing evil but shuts all doors to such shameless acts!! what do you see in a freely mixed society: illegal sex, teen pregnancies and thereby abandoned children, massive use of drugs and alcohol, adultery, fornication, prostitution and the list goes on…Is this not enough of a crime of a mixed society?? The very problem in this society and Islam gives you the solution. Even Christianity prohibits all this but ironically it is the Christian World which is full of this. The Muslims are more Christian than Christian themselves!!
I am not against Christians or anyone other sects but it is time for you people to stop asking Muslims to become less of Muslims and give up their freedom of faith just to be compatible with people like you!!
It is pathetic that this society is so ok with bikinis but pretend they don’t understand modest women and men. If everyone is modest then it is good for your family, your husbands, your sons and your society. There will be no betrayal and greed and lust and seduction!!
It is high time that you know what extremism is and what Islam is as a journalist!! Shame on you for not getting your facts straight and for misleading others rather than being vice versa as a journalist!!!
NEXT TIME please BE RESPONSIBLE WHEN YOU WRITE ABOUT ANYTHING FOR GOD SAKE!!
Well if hijab should be forbidden then you too should go naked because hijab means veil and clothes are a form of veil to our body, isn’t it??
Mam, we can comply by the laws of the land and fit our cultural and religious needs around those, if only those are Islamic. What if people here vote for walking nakedly on the road is ok calling it freedom of movement and walking modestly infringes those freedom…will you want us to comply!! I mean it may happen, you never know.
I am sorry about your ignorant view on Islam but it seems pretty naïve that you want people to have negative thoughts on Islam. Let me make it simple for you, Islam is the exact opposite of all of the negative stuff you have said.
I really urge you to get a proper understanding of Islam is because if you say Islam is all this then the bible should be all this too because your god is our prophet for god sake!
Its secular actually
You are not smart.
Read about Malaysia..Muslim country that accomadates everyone….stop watching so much tv and you won’t be scared.
Take a look at a map of the WTO member countries. You may understand the reason for all of this anti Islamic sentiment.
Well said.
You can be free in Canada,., but we’re scared of Muslims……because we all watch too much tv…..reel bad arabs documentary should be watched by all
The people are not secular. And have the right to practice….that’s law. Sorry bud but Canada accolades, or should accommodate, everyone. Hindu, Sikh, all of them.
If we are so secular why don’t we have school on Sunday??
Being kindest!? :…she must be oppressed ahaha because the majority of Canadians have a one track mind. Naked Is free, covered is not.dumb
And I care why that the people aren’t secular? Again, you miss the point. We are a SECULAR COUNTRY, meaning there is a separation of state and religion. We have absolutely no reason to accommodate religious beliefs, especially not in our public schools. When my mom came to Canada, they used to say the lord’s prayer in public school but discontinued that for the sake of immigrants. Why should muslims now get special treatment?
There is an anti-islamic sentiment because of the actions of radical muslims around the world. There are problems with muslims in every country where they form a majority or a significant minority.
If you don’t like it, don’t read it. Anyone would have questioned their relationship when they read Natasha’s full name at the beginning of the article. If someone doesn’t agree with the author’s opinion whenever they read their articles, they stop reading them.
Excuse me? Did you just state that your prophet is God?
Why ban all? Just ban the cult of Islam. It preaches hate, it preaches violence, it preaches misogyny.
Not really. We try to be secular for the sake of fairness in law, but Canada was founded upon Christian values. There is very little in Islam that is compatible with Canadian values. Other religions have few problems. Islam has a problem with every country it tries to settle in.
Stop using the word ‘Conservative’ Islam. I am a Conservative. That includes the values of rule of law (not sharia law) and other values.
Mannn that’s lame let me guess a student in humanities right !
What a joke. Canadian culture and values were put in place because of Christianity. Now I have to watch a foreign people populate my country and then change it to suite thier needs.
Merry Christmas! For 45 years I’ve known it as Christmas. Apparently in the last few years it has been changed to a festive season? What?
All who enter should obey OUR laws of the land. Why are we changing it to suite their law of the muslim land? The day I go to Saudi Arabia, and have a beer on the street, is the day I’m stoned to death. So, why are we changing for them?
Am I being to insensitive? Boo-hoo, go and cry in the country that you came from.
Natasha Fatah knows more about Islam than people like you. You go fight for your rights in your country. We will fight for what we believe is right in our own country. You pray privately or in your house of worship. Schools are for learning knowledge.
get rid of all religions, get out of the dark ages, shadows on walls….oooooo must be a creator, get your hand of it.
form your own muslim religion schools but DO NOT force this on CANADIANS. Harper will bend over to any ethnic, lbg group that will vote conservative.
We must reverse policy for religious accomodations. NO Accomodations for ANY religion ! NONE. The secularist, and moderates of all religions must wake up and fight radical versions of all religions. The most pressing of those being ultra-conservative Islam. Suadi Arabia manufactures this pernicous thought by creating and distributing hate filled books by the millions. They then export their vile cancerous ideology of sexism and barbarism to the west. Keep watchful eyes on the Imam’s, bring to light what the intolerance they preach. We must face this difficult issue. Do NOT accept one-way multiculturalism in order to “not offend” … no one has the right to be unoffended. Period. This is a very serious issue.
Religion does not belong in the schools if their children were too irresponsible to return to school after their Friday prayers they should not have the RIGHT to pray in my opinion. Also Religion should not be above equality. Of course in the article the one lady says “the girls don’t ask to sit in the front, the girls don’t like to be watched,” because the teach the girls and boys to be separate from a young age. They teach the girls that the shouldn’t be looked at and to feel bad about their sexuality. There are many religions which say if a woman is menstruating she should not come to pray, but guess what nowadays in my church they do not follow that idiotic rule. They’d rather have women praying regardless of their menstrual cycle. It is disgusting that their religion won’t bend at all to promote equality for their own daughters!!! As well if the teachers have to reteach a lesson because kids were absent due to prayers I don’t think that is fair. If you want your kids to be immersed in there strict religion then send them to a Muslim school.
Wow, another looney…sorry we don’t need to accommodate your religion over equality of men and women. There is a dark underside and it has mostly to do with making women feel inferior to men. This type of teaching doesn’t do much do deter sex. You only need to go to a University Library too see plenty of veiled good Muslim girls who have sex and pretend to be “pure” meanwhile when their parents think they are studying hard but really they are screwing around in the Library. Give me a break your religion does not help or promote “purity” or modesty…it just teaches the girls how to hide their sexuality and fake being pure. I’ve met too many Muslims who won’t drink but have no problem getting high on weed after school …I think you don’t give men enough credit, I’m sure they have enough impulse control to pray and not be consumed with perverted thoughts during prayer time. Your religion is all about separating women because they are sub-humans in the eyes of your religion. Why not train the men to not have impure thoughts as opposed to forcing constraints and restrictions on young girls? And prayers should not be in public institutions because they disrupt the main purpose of going to SCHOOL which is to get an education. You want to pray to your God then go to church, oh right the children where given the chance but were stupid, lazy and disrespectful and didn’t return to class on time….went home and watched tv and played video games. It isn’t the public schools job to promote your bloody religion. They shouldn’t be rewarded for bad behaviour. Oh and if they are doing prayers they should do it in bloody English so we know what is being taught and said. Take a look at the Trojan Horse scandal in the UK now, I would not be surprised if the same Anti-Christian messages aren’t being taught.
Sorry but if you checked out Greek town, what used to be 10 blocks of Greek/European businesses has turned into 5 blocks. Now there is a mosque down the road and 80% of the staff in restaurants are not even European…I attended my own cultural school on Saturdays which my parents paid for. I believe if someone wants to have their kids to learn and practice their culture and religion which has so many bloody demands then their parents should foot the cost and send them to private Muslim schools. Not force public schools to deal with class disruption which hinders the well being of one set of students for another set.
York Uni shouldn’t have a prayer room either. Esp during exam time it is very disruptive during an exam to have half the class get up and leave and lord knows what you are saying or sharing answers. It is a massive demand and it hinders other people’s well being.
There is a reason for separation of church and state. Actually, there are reasons for separation of church from nearly everything! And backward religious groups exacerbate the difficulties from which those reasons for “separation” occurred.
It is unfortunate when a tolerant society ends us feeling obligated to support the practice of intolerant religions within its own tax supported public institutions, for fear of being labelled intolerant itself. As in this case, we end up setting a poor example of what tolerance means if we allow others to exclude and marginalize members of our greater community and disempower our girls by example (both those girls practicing the observance and those forced to watch us support its practice). It is very important not to use the tax support of catholic schools as a reason to do this. Catholic schools are supported because of constitutional guarantees put in place at the time of unifying Canada, not because of tolerance or fairness. Today’s society would not support them in the absence of this constitutional guarantee which requires revising the constitution to alter. Our children will pay the price of our public support today of the practice of a religion that does not acknowledge the terrible consequences of its extremism. A religion where the vastly silent “peace loving” majority have not spoken out to protect the freedom and safety of people of other beliefs who are victims of its practice.
Canada is a Christian country. Educate yourself. Read the preamble to the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms. In the introductory sentence to the Constitution of Canada’s Charter of Rights and Constitution Act, 1982. In full, it reads,“Whereas Canada is founded upon principles that recognize the supremacy of God and the rule of l dah!!!!
Hold on. What do you actually know of Islam when you are saying all these insults to this religion. First of all, if you are a teacher you should know that a child’s safety is the top priority. Allowing kids to leave the school for prayers is risking the well being and education to the students. Second of all, the volunteers help with the Friday prayers are not payed!! Third, Islamic families and even non-Islamic families teach girls at a young age that being modest, in a state of mind and as well as physically is very important. If a group of girls stand in front of a group of boy, I can guarantee you prayer will not be what the boys are thinking about. Therefore, by standing behind the boys, girls will not be at all uncomfortable and go ahead with there prostration in peace and tranquility. SO the only person or ting to be ashamed should be yourself, know a little about Islam before you judge. As they say knowledge is power.
Have you ever heard of freedom of religion? Well by your offensive statement I think not.
In return, your statement is so typically Islamophobic.
Question: Is Canada a Christian country.. or a free country.
Your arguments are extremely biased, and if you have emotions, then all you should be feeling Is shame
the point is there should be no prayers at a public school
now we just need to do something about archaic practice of the Roman Catholic School Board
Just wanted to check, is FGM that has been ordered by ISIS in Iraq a part of the real Islam and Sharia law ? Since I dont know.
http://buzzpo.com/isis-orders-four-million-women-girls-genital-mutilation/
You could practice your faith in a Mosque. Definitely not in a School with children of different religious beliefs.
Minorities have rights! Do many Muslims forget that, even when they are a minority?
“Ali Baig, like Stefanoff, blames the debate over the prayer sessions on a
small group of people.”
At one time the Christian Lord’s prayer was done in school. No longer…… because of minority rights, which enforced a separation of state and religion.
But, I forget. Conservative Islam, has no separation of state and religion, and no consideration for minorities. Sharia law!
Canadians who bend over backwards to accommodate these primitives are posing a danger to our future.
But if it were Christians wanting prayer time they would thrown in jail
Can’t the girls be on the other side of the room and not behind the boy’s rear ends, but alongside? That would not be demeaning and the girl’s would not find it so easy to eye the cute boys ahead of them.
I have seldom heard such unmitigated bafflegab in my entire lifetime.
Islamic prayer in schools and particularly supposed Christian schools is like opening a coven alter in their midst.. 1 John 2:22.. he that denieth the Father and the Son is a liar.. he is antichrist…. what fellowship has Light to do with darkness…. (chrislam is on the move folks).
Can these schools permit other religion practices? School is meant only for academics not as any other activity other than education. We do not want to enroll our kids in the Valley Park though it is very closer to us. I heard from one of my friend’s kid who is in grade 2, got threatened by the fellow Muslim student, saying that when he grow as an adult will get a machine gun and kill all non-Muslims in Canada! Is that what we want in our schools? How the Canadian Government is going to tackle the future?
First these politicians should change their attitude for obtaining vote SHAME on them!!!. They were the one allowed prayers inside the school just to get voted. These politicians never think about CANADA except their seat in the parliament. May be Ali and his wife do not agree in what I say but that’s the Truth. I am not against Islam but it should not be inside the schools and I would advise them not to teach violence to the young kids! Canada is a beautiful country to live and enjoy please do not convert this as a torn country. Treat others with love, do not force others to accept with your religious opinion, it will bounce back as the ball!
I am not bounded to any religion, Canada is the country with dominant Christian and they are the one created it. These Christians are the one written all the constitutional by-laws and the legal systems here to live with peace and harmony. Well these Christians are the one invited Muslims and other numerous faith followers to this country. Obviously you can see Canada’s education system is very Christian. Can Ali and his wife become a citizen of Saudi Arabia? NO! Can they take their national cultural activity and implement in UAE? NO! Can they ask Arabs to follow their country’s system? NO!
Abusing a Human right is not good for the peaceful life!
Did the Canadian Government say not to pray or not to build a Mosque?
Well if you guys want your own Islamic verse of school system get permission and build those schools and take your kids over there! STOP SPOILING TDSB!
Well said!
Would they?
Ask the politicians who let this happen just for votes!
Wake up! write about this to your local politicians. Tell them you don’t support and will call others to do the same!
Talk to your MPP and MP
I like it!
No other Religion has any problem with Canadian Law! Canada founded and created by the Christians you were no where by that time!
How about an Islamic swimming pool?
Anti Islamic is not sentiment, I have Muslim friends we had no difference until you start demanded that you want something not others can not do!
Malaysia needed investments and workers from other countries that’s why it let the other religious people! Well Malaysia was not originally an Islamic Nation like middle east! Even before it got converted, other nationalities were living there! Search Google!
go here https://thenonconformer.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/islam.jpg
https://thenonconformer.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/islam.jpg Is there any other religious name in this? Why yours?
Islam is all about reality. If a girl prayed alongside she is not only risking the attention away from the boy behind her, but those to left of her and to the right. You might say, not all men would be distracted by this but, lets just remember the billion dollar corporations that thrive off women’s sexuality, and its number one customer, the male gender. Now, I’m not in any way blaming a women for being a women , imagine being in a classroom, normally the disciplined would be seated at the back because of the trust teacher have in them. The less disciplined have their place in the front because the teacher would need to keep an eye on them. This shows the concept I an trying to show you, that in this area of discipline girls win.
In Islam women are actually held at a high standard. They are not meant to stay at home cleaning and cooking all day, but rather it is something they are taking on themselves. Its actual the mans job to make his wife feel as comfortable as they can. SO by saying Islam is trying to demean women, you could not be more wrong. IT is permissible for women to pray alongside men when there is a barrier between. But other than that Islam would not want to risk the uncomfort of a women.
Also, on the subject of girls eyeing the “cute boys in front of them”, women are more attracted to the face of a male, not so much the backside. Also, I think that girls are more likely to focus even with the male gender in front of them.
Like I said, its all about reality, taking the most common problems and trying to make a state of comfort for the victims. If you have any other questions about this school decision, give them a call I’m sure they would be happy to give a brief run through of the placing.
Until Next Time,
Zabi101
In doing that, how would that allow change and prosperity to occur. The great country of Canada, is multicultural land, which means there are so many different cultures and religion here, who are we to take that away?
See there is where your comment is wrong. What if I was born here, raised here so by telling to go back to where I come from well, I’m already here aren’t I?
Islam in no way is portrayed in anything that the group ISIS preaches, to add on to that, their is a verse in our holy book that say to beware of the one who wave to black flag, for they say to preach the religion but do not follow it themselves.
Female Genital Mutilation is something that Islam Is highly against. We believe that god made us perfect the we are, and we are not to harm or deface ourselves in any way. AT the same time, I am not fully familiar with the Sharia law, but I am highly convinced that it follows the same way of Islam, since it is our prophet law. Great question by the way
Until Next Time,
Zabi101
Maybe because in a farm full of white sheep it is easier to see those who are black. Why must base Islam by the wrongdoings of people. See in return I could name many war and battles that Islam has not started, but unlike you I respect every religion and culture. So now you tell me, what do you have against Islam, and I’m not talking about the people but the religion itself.
Reality?!? What reality?!? You are delusional. You need to be separated from women, because you are all rapists deep down inside. Just look at the prevalence of rape in your sick culture. You have no self control, so you need to cover the women up. Pathetic! I can’t believe you think you are doing women a favour by subjugateing them. So completely absurd. I also need to point out, that you clearly know nothing about islam. Go back to sleep moron.
ISIS is following the same Qur’an as every other muslim. You should give it a read sometime, and stop talking out of your ass. I’m not muslim and I took the time to read it. Now I know what we are up against, and how unspeakably disgusting your ideology really is. Soon everyone in the western will know. Soon you will no longer be tolerated. Soon you will awake the beast in all of us. You know, the one that wiped out whoever stood in the way of world colonization. The white beast is just sleeping, but you maggots are gonna wake him up. I can not wait!
I think that it is important for Muslim boys to learn to control their impulses regarding females. If this isn’t started when they are young, they will never be strong in that regard. Putting all the responsibility on girls and women and expecting them to be the strong sex is unfair…..even though maybe they are.
It’s not only muslim men I was talking about, but the male gender in general. How can you separate a Muslim boy from a Catholic boy, both are of the male gender regardless of their religion. In Islam, their a line from a Hadith ( something said by our prophet) ” lower your gaze,which applies to both sexes.
Both men and women in Islam are both are both regarded as the “strong sex”, the difference between them is the different duties they uphold.
im glad you brought this to my attention, how you view our religion, but I beg of you that you make your own proper conclusions, not based on the media.
Zabi101
Reading your rebuttal got me thinking, if you know so much about Islam, them why did you call it a culture. If you know so much about Islam, you would know that rape is a humungous crime. If you know so much about Islam, you would that Men and Woman are equal, no one over the other, equal. I don’t know who you are, for all I know you could be a 40 year old man/woman who watches porn all day. But I know you have something against a Mu’min, not the religion. Have you ever thought that women In Islam cover up because they feel a sense of comfort, a sense of closeness to our Lord. There is no man forcing me to cover up, I do it for the sake of modesty and comfort, my modesty and comfort. What I need to point out is, that you clearly judged Islam by the evil of some, not by the good of many. In all my life I have never met someone so ridiculously islamophobic , but at the same time tries to say they know more about Islam than me, a person who spent there whole learning of this peaceful religion. You need to wake up, because for someone that ignorant, you must have been asleep for a very long time.
Zabi101
Sorry but the amount of ignorance in this comment is horrific.
http://thinkprogress.org/world/2014/09/25/3572061/muslim-scholars-against-isis/
Give this a read, and maybe try spouting your lies on Islam to someone who hasn’t spent their life reading, memorizing and translating the Quran.
Zabi101
P.S, I’d imagine you read half a sentence of a translation of my holy book, before coming here and humiliating yourself.
Your whole life studying the words a a rapist pedophile? So you think it’s OK to marry little girls off to hideous old men? Rape is as common in the muslim world, as car crashes are here in the west, is that OK as well? In what universe are men and women “equal” in islam? Are you delusional? It’s very, very, very clear how Mohammad felt about your kind. Or do you just conveniently ignore that part of the fairytale? Why not try reading something written by a literate person, who actually understand something about the world. You have spent your life memorizing lies, and you are proud of that? And then you justify your subjugation, by telling me it make you feel more comfortable. WOW! No one makes you dress like a bee keeper? You do it of your own accord? That is even more sad. You are weak, and pathetic, and you deserve the treatment you get from the followers of your idiotic MAN MADE story. Grow up, and have some self respect. Disgusting! You are a disgrace to all women, and you should be ashamed of yourself!
Humiliated? By you?? HAHAHAHAHA that is hilarious. You follow a religion that subjugates you. In islam you are nothing more, than a place for disgusting, unwashed, hairy men to ejaculate, and you think I feel humiliated?? Wow, you really are delusional. You walk around covering your skin at all times, because Mohammed was a sick and twisted creature, who could not look at a woman’s body without raping her. That is where your sick tradition comes from. There’s some truth for you. Not for modesty, or any such non-sense, it’s because your “prophet” was a RAPIST! I feel no humiliation, I am a free thinking human being, who is intelligent enough not to fall for idiotic superstitions. I have nothing to be ashamed of. Your whole existence is embarrassing, to yourself, and to all women. Have some self respect.
And enough with the “islamophobia” non-sense. We are not afraid of you, we are disgusted by you. We are disgusted by the way you think, the way you behave, and by all of you despicable “traditions”. Do not mistake disgust, for fear. Everything about you is WRONG in every imaginable way.
Your “holy book” was written by an illiterate, pedophile, rapist. Or did you skip that part? Fucking imbecile, just die!
See this is what I mean, you know know nothing of Islam . You are ignorant and that’s all your are ever going to be. You think rape is ok in Islam, because if you do, that just proves my point. In Islam that is one of the most hideous of crimes a person might do. All your trying to do here is insult me. But how? I am proud of the Arabic lines I have memorized, they are the words of my lord. I know their meanings and I know that the prophet in my religion wasn’t the cruel man you portray him to be. See you say a lot, but you know none. And as for me, how am I weak, pathetic if I chose to wear an abaya and hijab. I think that I am strong, instead of listening the the pressures of the media at this age, I wear what I want to, because I want to. Real beauty is inside, and I don’t mean looks, but strength, perseverance. Me? Have no self-respect? You are the one preaching hate on here without any knowledge. It’s foul and foolish. Humiliating. Think before you say, because right now all that is coming out of the idiotic mouth of your is false facts.
Laughing at your attempt to win this debate,
Zabi101
But how does disgust happen, when fear is hidden, when knowlegde is taken when when false facts are given. We are all just humans beings, but some seem to act and talk like monsters, starting with you.
Seems like you have given up by your lame attempt of a rebuttal. Do you even know who believe wrote our holy book? No. I didn’t think so because you are ignorant, and that’s all I’ll ever be. How could I skip that part, remember I’ve memorized the Quran page by page word by word.
Zabi101
P.S. Why would I kill myself, am I not content with the life I have now. But if that is what you are trying to do now ( kill yourself) why don’t you seek some therapy, maybe they’ll fix that inner-hatred you harbour for yourself.
You, intelligent, that must be a joke. In all my life I have never seen some so uneducated and illogical. You know nothing of our Prophet, our religion. Let me explain this in a way you’ll understand, no one controls me, I am the boss of myself.
But you won’t stop, is it not humiliating enough for to say words without any proof of them being right. You have a lot to be ashamed of, first is of you ignorance, secong your stupidity and third your self respect.
Our prophet was not a rapist, he was a respected man. If you knew anything about him, you would know that. You’re only in Embarrassing yourself, and you have to read anything you wrote, it’s hilarious.
You are one of the mistakes mankind has created, along with global warming, and greenhouse gases.
Zabi101
you guys are pathetic i think this was and is a great idea i am sorry but i think martin Luther king said enough. Canada is a Multicultural place and Toronto is also a Multicultural place so u guys have no right to judge these people have some empathy! Put yourself in there shoes! U guys who decide to fight over this are ridiculous! like seriously be afraid of god inshallah this program will stay for as long valley park middle school the best school in the world exists with god’s will inshallah!
you know what Your not the prime minister so go argue with Steven Harper dude cause u make no sense! FYI its a middle school
If your tired get out of Canada dude this is not Ur country i am 100% Canadian citizen hogwash yourself christian terrorists!
excuse me? you people disgust me canada is not a Christian country its a multicultural country. You have no right to tell canada what to do! don’t u understand!
Again u have no right to tell Muslims what to do i can tell u to go suicide would you? so stop complaining Muslim’s are so sweet i don’t even think anyone here has ever even spoken to a Muslim because Ur too much in favor of yourselves! stop being so arrogant we are all humans!
it doesn’t have to okay canada is already awoken ur the one who is sleeping
go kill urself dude!
u preach hate u preach violence get up dude this is reality!
I wish u were extinct cause u make no sense dude go learn about Islam then learn what is right cause i am certain that when u find out u it will be too late…..
a girl is not aloud to pray with a unknown guy don’t you get it would u feel comfortable praying beside a guy who u don’t know!
If Ur a teacher have some shame! tdsb is awesome ur dumb ur dumber than me! how can u be a racist teacher! May u be cursed! may u lose ur job! and i am serious dude! I don’t know how you would act on a bullying situation ur a racist and rude and unbearable thing! ur not even a human being!
exactly well said there student! Now take your multicultural Muslim prayers the hell out of a multicultural public school. And you Muslims have no effin right to tell multicultural Canada what to do in a multicultural public school. Now go cover your face with a ninja looking mask, sit at the back of the bus/room, serve your father, brother and husband unconditionally and have a wonderful life praying to skydaddy child molester moe-ham-ad
Canada is is a multicultural society not so we can segregate everyone but so we can throw everyone in the same pot and see what comes out……If people don’t like it the move to a segregated country not one like Canada that doesn’t need changing!!
remember what multicultural means (melting pot and all) there is a reason why we removed religion from schools but allow religion to start there own school. it allows us to have a safe harmony within our school system that don’t lead to problems like these whether wrong or right………….
This is a Christian country. But we believe in freedom of religion which is why the lords prayer was removed from our schools! We are the proud melting pot of the world! Come together and be Canadian whoever you are but leave your religion at HOME where it belongs..or there is no melting pot just segregated pizza of all different toppings!!
Thank you for the great comment its nice to hear common sense!
What a hypocrite! What garbage you can hear your sexiest innuendo in your supposed words of knowledge. Insulting this teacher for saying the truth is why people are turning against muslims in general. Wake up before its to late this is supposed to be 2014 not 1942!!
I was once told that if you have knowledge does not, tell them, what they do next is on there own accord. This teacher didn’t recognize that there are multiple religions and cultures in Canada, before she insulted them all. It is 2014 shouldn’t this be the age of acceptance, embracing groups of people as they are. For someone this ignorant you mush have been asleep for a long time.
It’s a hospital for god’s sake. People are in there to get well. Why not just allow them the right to eat and enjoy their meals without the worry of it being against their religion? Plus, halal meat is cleaner than it’s non-halal counterpart. The blood has been drained from the meat. I don’t see why it’s such a big deal, non-muslims can also indulge in halal meats and food! Sure you’ll have to give up pork at the time of your stay or visit, but is that really such a bad thing?
It’s a twenty minute walk from the school to the mosque. Surely the school can accommodate these Muslim students by excusing them from school on Fridays, allowing enough time for a healthy walk to and from their place of worship.
Thank you atleast SOMEONE has an open mind about the meaning of ‘multicultural’ well said !this is a free country if you want to practice you religion,then do it you have every right to! :) be happy dont judge……..just because a few muslims have done horrible crimes doesn’t mean that all of them are like that…….please give muslim people a chance and i’m sure you wont regret it P.S im a muslim(female with hijab) yet i have many friends that are indians,christians,muslims and more, and they’re all wonderful! ;)
Just because you write paragraphs of bloody English doesn’t mean you know anything about Islam or the Muslims! After all, I do not deny there must be bloody muslims who are whores like you!
The parent should be responsible for their children returning to classes after prayers at the mosque. It is their responsibility, not the school. This is just so obvious.
It says the supremacy of God, not supremacy of the Christian God. God is God, period. The preamble means all religions are welcome.
10-15 Minutes Friday Prayers creating lots of Problem for Christians..But what about Christian Convents schools where every students are Forced to pray inspite they don’t belong to Christianity..
BAN ISLAM. WAKE UP CANADA.
I don’t see how safe it to have kids praising a pedophile like muhammad
I miss a word or two about the contents of those prayers: http://precaution.ch/tafsir/00_Fatiha_A4_e.pdf
Here is a solution, send them back to their birth country and don’t bother CANADIANS
Agreed… It’s unsafe to have kids look up to Pedophiles from 1300 years ago… we should all look up to current pedophiles… Like Catholic Priests…
At least that religion doesn’t condone it like islam does. Go look up all the child brides and not just in the middle east, they are also being allowed by the leftest to marry in the west.
Basing your view of an entire religion based on that is like someone basing a view on Christianity based on the Mormons
Well their prophet did it. Their holy book supports it and their imams preach it. Tell me again how i’m being unfair?
Maybe you need to stop believing everything you read on the Internet.
Tell you what i did stop believing in. It was the crap my imam use to ramble on about.
Lol… like you’ve ever been to a mosque or listened to one of their preachers.
Ok. What ever gets you through the day
Qur’an
(5:51) – “O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the
Christians for friends
um what happened to the National Anthem and the daily Prayer,we were told it wasnt allowed in schools anymore because it offended some religions,same as Christmas. Why should muslims be allowed to pray in school????
You should be learning how to spell instead of writing comments on the internet!
EXCUSE ME????????
Go back to your books!
Have you seen the pictures of Trudeau in his white robe praying with the Muslims at a Mosque? Get over your hatred of our PM
Yeah leave us alone in our cultural suicide. All other cultures come before the one that invented the printing press. You dirty Euro lovers.
Typical Liberal/Progressive statement. I suppose that it’s ok with you that the girls are at the back and of course the girls on their periods are forced right to the back! Stupid person!
You’re a special kind of stupid aren’t you?
Before making ridiculous assumptions know the reason behind this. In Islam woman and men are equal, and matters aee reasoned with equity. For example, woman on their period sitting at the back. This is because God gives woman a break from praying and other religious obligations when on they are on this time period. Girls sitting at the back is because of that is to not disrupt the prayer ahead. Your accusation of “stupid person” is extremely unprofessional and utterly misplaced, as I had the knowledge of the situation before going on the Internet to write a comment about something I knew about. Islam is a religious of peace and equality, so next time I suggest you research before actually giving a valid opinion. ( And If freedom of religion is a ‘liberal’ statement, then koodos to them.)
They have removed the Christian-Judeo aspect from shools.Why the hell are these sub-humans being allowed to pray to their pedophile,rapist,murderer mohammed.If christains can’t pray I school,neither should these assholes.
Regardless of your viewpoint … this should not be allowed since no other ‘faith’ group is allowed to hold or conduct a service of their faith in any Ontario public school that I’m aware of. Always the Muslims who get their way and are treated with kid gloves compared to anyone else!! If you’re going to have Muslim prayer services then let’s have the LORD’s prayer reinstated in all schools and Christian bible studies which are NOT allowed. We are NOT a muslim nation and we’re not founded nor established on the Muslim faith. Parents should not look to the public school system to encourage nor propogate Muslim ideology that belongs in the mosque. They have no problem using ‘non-muslim’ property for muslim prayer service, wonder what would happen if those of any non-mulsim faith attempted to use a mosque for a service?? They wouldn’t be the least bit accommodating for sure! The Muslim religion is the ONLY religion that seeks to change the ‘lay of the land’ and cannot leave things as they are. The U.K. has entire neighbourhoods now ‘run’ by Muslims who will ‘come after you’ if you enter …. it will soon happen here given time!
We have an entire separate school dedicated and funded with tax payer dollars for catholic education and no one bats an eye but allow a school with the majority of children Muslim to pray and it is the newspapers. Either fully separate schools and religions or not. What we have presently is an extremely discriminatory system.
Are you sure that you aren’t quoting the Qu’ran?
I’ll tell you what happened to Canada, racist f*cks like you.
I oppose the practice of Witchcraft. Does that make me a racist?
(You do know that there are black, brown and white Muslims ..well maybe you don’t.)
PE Trudeau
Oh yes I’ve seen the ‘religion of peace” acting that way often. Give me strength would you? Islam is a political philosophy masquerading as a religion. It governs all facets of life. Sharia law is its base and enshrouding women totally in head to toe clothing including their faces is nothing but a man-made construct used to control women to do as they’re told. ” Girls sitting at the back is because of that is to not disrupt the prayer ahead.” – well there’s a typical statement that’s in line with those who blame women wearing short skirts at fault for being sexually assaulted including rape! Please blow it out your ear and join the modern world. I keep hearing about all these “moderate Muslims” yet I don’t hear much from them when people are being blown up all over the world – the vast majority of them Muslims!
As much as fox news and ill rumors guide you in life, Islam is a religion of peace. If my religion values modesty, then what exaxtly is the problem. See, you are taking something out of nothing. Twisting words into ridiculous statements that absolutely make no sense. Let me ask you this, if a person is praying would you just step infront of them or sit beside and talk while they are in prostration. Common sense, the girls sitting at the of the prayer are able to talk to each other but it would be far to distracting to put them beside a praying person.
So your saying islam is not apart of the ‘modern world’, well then I suppose that I don’t want to be apart of this world, that judges people on what they wear and the values the follow. What really astounds me is that people are so easy to assume. Trust me a day in the life of a Muslim is not preaching hate and making bombs, but a typical lifestyle with free time praying to our Lord.
When rape or sexually assault occurs to women it’s not about what you wear or how you act. People who commit those disgusting acts don’t care. It can happen to anyone.
Don’t judge. Have respect. Know the facts. Know islam.
Wow your examples drip in misogyny. A couple of girls will talk to each other a disrupt prayers – really? That’s your “common sense?’ No sir Islam is nothing more than a fascist, controlling and horrible way of conducting your life. Islam dictates how you will live your life and does not allow and in fact violently condemns anyone who disagrees with that philosophy. No Sir, Islam is not a religion of peace as professed. It is a religion based on conquest, killing, torturing and subduing people who do not believe. – and that’s from your “blessed” but useless Koran!
Wow what a bubble wrapped world you live in! Islam is a political philosophy masquerading as a religion. It is a religion that is misogynistic and hateful to those who are different. Good old Mo said that if people don’t convert they are to pay a tax and be second class citizens or they are to be killed. Oh yes and let’s not forget about good old Mo’s proclivities toward being a freaking paedophile!
Prophet Muhammad (saw) treated everyone with the most respect. Even when his own family spread ill rumors about him, and people would throw rock at him, he did not think of them as inferior, nor did he ever make them pay a tax. Islam is not hateful, we are taught to respect everyone regardless of there religion, tribe, race. That is true islam. No one was forced to convert. It is a choice peopke make because they believe it. He is not a pedophile. Times then and now are immensly different. Marrying Aisha at nine was the norm back then. Also, in islam a woman must be ‘woman’ to be married, showing us that girls back then matured faster then now. Please have a little respect. Islam has taught me peace and undying respect.
Islam is a religion. To me, a perfect one. Claiming that islam is a political philosophy is quite dim minded. Have you ever read any of the hadith? Our blessed Quran? Do you really know anything about islam? No, you don’t. But unlike you, I don’t a spread hate about any religion or anyone.
God bless you. I hope you have a great day, and you see my point of view, god willing.
Again, speaking with ignorance will get you nowhere. Isla mm is more than a religion, it is a way of life. Your misconception of how terrorism is linked to islam is immensly false. Conducting my life with the religion is a way to find peace and gather oneself five times a day. A religion that urges you to do good, and to be good. Don’t mix up extremists ridiculous beliefs with islam. True islam. Regular Muslims don’t have bomb classes or act out in psychotic was, torturing and killing, something that is a huge sin in islam.
And secondly, when an exam is taking place, do you sit among the students quietly chatting and looking at the from aside. No. Usually, you are sent to the back where you can continue to talk and stare. Sir, don’t you think it’s rude to sit and stare and another while they are in prostration, my conscience thinks so, how about yours?
The Quran is a blessed book, with amazing words and insightful messsages. Nowhere does it condemn mass murder and terrorism. Moreso, it actually forbids it. If you like give it a read maybe you’ll find the answers to other questions of yours.
Have a great day.
Christian prayers are not banned. My high school had a christian fellowship club that did its own religious activities. We also had some muslim students go to a room to do friday prayers. It’s called being accomodating of everyone. this school is an unusual scenario because of the very large muslim population but im sure if some christian wanted time to pray because they felt aa religious need, they would be accomodated the same way.
Christians and jews are given their religious days off. Schools don’t operate on saturdays or sundays which are the days of rest of jewish and christian people respectively. i also work in a place that is open on weekends and we always accomodate people who need certain days off for religious including Christians who need Sundays off
“Pedophilia or paedophilia is a psychiatric disorder in which an adult or older adolescent experiences a primary or exclusive sexual attraction to prepubescent children, generally age 11 years or younger”
How old was Aisha again?
What a hogwash of propaganda. Bring in a Muslim journo who seemed to be against the segregation of boys and girls in the cafeteria /prayer room and them the he will write a piece that shows really that it was after all the girl’s idea to delegate the females at the back and the boys in the front because otherwise it will distract the boys from praying. Innocent enough excuse….but then he goes on the get into the background of the complainers and it seems they were all bigoted, haters of Islam……Sounds familiar ?